Severe Swirls, Need Pro Work?

F

foxtrotter

New member
I just bought the car. Previous owner only washed in machine car wash. Theres severe bug stain pits on the nose with severe swirls over the entire finish. On the hood PC w/ Yellow/IP and White/FPII. Used about an 1/8 or more of the IP on the hood. Swirls still remain, probably 60% are gone. My theory are 1.) My cutting pad is either too aggresive or not aggresive enough 2.) Im working the area to long 3.) The swirls are so severe they need professional work



Heres the pics



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I dont know man, but I can certainly tell you I have run into that problem with a black vehicle I had to detail. With a PC, it turned into an 8 hr process for the exterior only, but I was able to remove move most of the swirls, light scratches & water spots.

Used a Orange Propel pad w/ a compound that as worked went from agressive to a fine polish.

I then moved to VM usinga Green Lt Propel pad, finishing with a Sealant.



I now have a rotary and am learning the proper technique, in the hopes next time one of these come to me and can become more efficient/proficient in the restoration of the finish.
 
On the last pictures I didn't notice the little tiny dots until the next morning, I think those are just water deposits from the millions of beads that form with the morning dew. As for my bug pit marks on the nose, they are more noticeable now after i polished, they have a white color now, probably from the polish getting in there.
 
A few passes of IP should be able to remove the swirls, unless you have really hard paint (I'm not familiat with those cars). After each pass you should notice the major swirls being reduced. If not, then you're probably not being aggressive enough. If they are reduced but some new smaller swirls are appearing, then you're not working the IP enough.

It'll most likely take a fair bit of work, but I see no reason that the PC with IP won't be enough, unless like I said before, you have really hard paint. Still, I've managed to polish out ceramiclear with it, although it took some effort and 2-3 passes.
 
it really looks liek there is still some prduct left over on the alst two shots! I mean you really ahve to take a step back and look at what your doing. Make sure you pads are clean, make sure your product is right, ect. U may be putting in more swirls then your taking out. Also if you have any doubt that you might not be working it long enough take just one panel i.e. hood and play around with your products and make sure your system works before moving on to do the rest of the car.



-Justin
 
foxtrotter said:
On the last pictures I didn't notice the little tiny dots until the next morning, I think those are just water deposits from the millions of beads that form with the morning dew. As for my bug pit marks on the nose, they are more noticeable now after i polished, they have a white color now, probably from the polish getting in there.
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At 1st I was thinking that was bad acid rain damage. Thank god that's not the case.
 
If anything, you pointed out how picture taking can be so deceiving. People ooohhh and aaahhh over cars that still have defects, except at a different angle and lighting, look awesome - particularly the 8, 9, 10 shots and then the next morning shots.



You weren't using the wrong prodcuts necessarily. The IP isn't *that* aggressive. First, be sure to clay your paint. http://www.guidetodetailing.com/articles.php?articleId=14 You can try the Poorboys SSR 2.5 for a bit more bite. You want to use it with a cutting pad moving at a slow, overlapping pace with pressure for a few passes. Then ease up on the pressure for a few passes. Then allow the weight of the buffer to polish the surface for a few more passes. Do this until it almost clears out and before it dries. Buff off and examine. Work in 2 x 2 areas. Move to your FP and a polish pad. Work the 2 x 2 area with some pressure then just the weight of the buffer. Wipe off before it dries up.



The key is knowing your pads and polishes. Knowing how they break down and polish out.



Be sure to use clean pads. Don't be afraid to use multiple pads for each polish. Buff off with a soft microfiber.



It takes practice and an understanding that on some hard paints, the PC has it's limitations. That's why there is a cyclo and then the rotary.



Here is a video about using the rotary. But you can pick up some good tips about the PC too.



http://www.bettercarcare.com/articles.php?articleId=31&page=1



Or, you can check this out regarding the PC.



http://www.guidetodetailing.com/articles.php?articleId=47
 
I did claybar that day, the car wasn't to bad, I found the clay to be most effective on the top of the bumper. That dirt wouldn't budge until i hit it with the clay.



As far as polishing I'm still not sure if its my procedure. The hood was worked for atleast an hour with the Yellow Wolfgang 6.5" pad and IP. I used every kind of pressure and movement that you guys said. The same goes with the white pad and FPII, except that I only made a few passes with that.

Maybe I'll give it another go, I was kind of hesitant to work it that long, I didn't want to burn through the clear. Any more input would be greatly appreciated.
 
foxtrotter said:
Maybe I'll give it another go, I was kind of hesitant to work it that long, I didn't want to burn through the clear.
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I wouldn't worry about that too much with the PC.



From the pics it looks like the paint could use some rotary work.
 
anyone else had experience with this kind of paint? I've heard that the corvette has hard paint, maybe this is the case.......its a 2000 Chevy Camaro.
 
I usually start from least agressive and work my way up. How many passes are you doing and at what speed?



Also what year is the Camaro?
 
It's a 2000 Camaro. I think i might have found my problem. When i was doing the multiple passes i was trying to do half the hood at once. I'm going to try to do smaller section and see if this gets me results. But im still wondering if im using to much product and how many passes i can do on one area...Is 10 passes ("Pass" for lack of better terminology, I mean apply, buff, inspect) for one area excessive?



And speed is at 4.5
 
foxtrotter said:
It's a 2000 Camaro. I think i might have found my problem. When i was doing the multiple passes i was trying to do half the hood at once. I'm going to try to do smaller section and see if this gets me results. But im still wondering if im using to much product and how many passes i can do on one area...Is 10 passes ("Pass" for lack of better terminology, I mean apply, buff, inspect) for one area excessive?



And speed is at 4.5
Click to expand...





Here I found someones website from this site, forgot whose it is. Credit goes to them, it is a member here. It shows the breakdown stages

http://users.ca.astound.net/blkyukon/cars/#polish



Yes you want to work on very small areas and if you want, tape them off so you can compare your work. Work smaller areas, use a few dabs of product on the pad(too much product will be hard to breakdown). And run a few passes on the area, my passes it means how many times you run it up and down and sideways. Do the passes until polish breaksdown(check link for pics). You might then need to follow up with a finer polish if you have micromarring.



Also, start working at a slow speed and once the polish is spread out then up the speed to 5 or so. I usually spread and work it in at speed 3, then bump it up to 5 or 6.



Hope that helps! Also read the links for more help and info! Also see this

http://www.guidetodetailing.com/articles.php?articleId=47



:)
 
Only telling from the pics, it does look like most of the swirls can be taken with an agressive combo of polish and pad via PC (maybe 70% will come out.) Again just by looking at the pics, to get near 90-100% swirls and etching removal, rotary work is a must. Just my opinion, you all have to remember that the PC cant generate much heat and has its limits. When I started using the rotary I saw results quicker and better x2!!
 
I have had somewhat similar issues.



One thing that helps me, is working in artificial light. I have a few large, overhead fluorescent lights in the garage. I also set up a high powered halogen work light on a tripod as I work. And for a final inspection I use a high powered halogen flashlight to look at the surface in many different angles.



I'll give you my advice. SSR2.5 with a white lake country pad will remove a LOT of the surface impercections still in your paint. However, it, in itself will create some imperfections. Follow that up with Optimum Polish with a fresh white L.C. pad, and then once again with Optimum polish on a black L.C. finishing pad. Throw on some Vanilla Moose Hand Glaze and then a Carnuba of your choice and she'll be gleamin'. Again, this is what I have found to work really, REALLY well for me.



Check this thread I just started...

http://autopia.org/forum/showthread.php?t=66305
 
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