List of water based leather conditioners/cleaners?

Roger Koh said:
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Show us a picture!



You may need Leather Prep either pH 7.7 or a leather-safe version pH 4.4 if the aniline leather is absorbent.



In addition a pH 10.3 Leather Bleach Cream is an option only if the aniline leather has a NON-ABSORBENT topcoat.





Pick up the samples and try it out!



Roger Koh

Leather Doctor®
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judyb said:
Hi David

If this is a true aniline leather (one that is absorbent) then the dye will have soaked into the leather itself (as aniline dye does during the original finishing process). If this is the case then the dye is permanent and any type of 'cleaners' will not remove it as they will only clean from the surface of the leather. Unfortunately the dye cannot be removed from the leather itself (there are processes that can be used on pigment coated leather) and unlike pigment coated leather you cannnot recolour in the same way as you would need to use dyes and not pigments - dyes are transparent and so the 'damaged' areas will always show through. You can use pigments to recolour but this will change the leather from an aniline into a pigement coated.



If the aniline leather has a clearcoat finish and is not absorbent (or only has a slow absorbency rate) then you could try a stronger cleaner or an alcohol cleaner as the dye from the belt may be sitting in the finish instead of the leather itself. It may also be possible to recolour this using a very light coat of pigment to disguise the damage but you would have to use a very intensely coloured pigment system for this to work.



Please also offer advice to your client on fluorocarbon protectors as these will help to inhibit this type of problem form happeningn again - this is crucial on all aniline style leathers.



Hope this helps
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I forwarded the owner the link to this & he was kind enough to send me some pics:



Rolls2.jpg




rolls3.jpg




Rolls1.jpg




Rolls4.jpg
 
David Fermani said:
Yeah, they're like a leather wrapped tempurpedic mattress. :D
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===



Who says that it "cannot" be removed?



And who says it "Can"?



WITHOUT DAMAGES TO THE FINISH - that's the criteria of the removal challenge!



And Why?





Roger Koh

Leather Doctor®
 
I'm torn between being optimistic, but realistic at the same time. Planning a vacation to S. Florida any time soon to show us the light?
 
David Fermani said:
I have a client with a new Rolls Royce Phantom that I inspected yesterday. It has gray aniline leather and somehow a passenger's brown belt dye transferred to the rear seat. I tried LM stong cleaner without any success. I realize the lighter colored leather has been essentially stained by a darker one, but are there any alternatives (besides recoloring) that can be done to correct this problem? Thanks -
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===



Chances are good without the need to do a cover-up with coloring!



Using a water-based "Leather Prep" will not damages the finish.



If the dyes are penetrated a "Leather Bleach" helps to kill the dyes without harm to the pigment.



The products are among the water-based auto leather cleaner and conditioner samples except the "leather Bleach".



Have you seen the link to the samples yet?



Like to check the severity of this problem.



Question:



You said it is a gray aniline leathers - I have yet to see aniline leathers in gray!



When you tried with LM strong cleaner what tools or material you used along with the removing process (sponge, brush, pads, etc) ?



Did the leather darkens or remain the same color when wet?



Did you tried the entire stain areas or part of it.



Without any success - do you mean looks the same the before and after?



Do you think, by chance this cushion can be removed and send to me?







Do you have any success with “Blue Jean Dye Transfer Stain Removal� in the other occasions?







Roger Koh

Leather Doctor®
 
Hi David



Looking at the photos I would hesitate to say it is definitely an aniline leather. Generally speaking leather of that colour will have been pigmented as you rarely get aniline leathers that colour.



If it has (as it appears) got some type of surface coating on it the process to follow would be:



Maxi Cleaner

Alcohol Cleaner



These two stages will remove any dye transfer that can be safely removed without damaging the finish on the leather. 'Bleaches' should not be used as they will almost certainly cause damage.



If these two stages do not remove the dye then a very light pigment coating can be applied to recolour. This would not require a full recolour as long as you had a pigment that matched the leather.



As with all these type of processes they are not cleaning processes. They are what we call technical processes that require the knowledge to use stage by stage products which may eventually lead to recolouring. The process may be enough at any stage and should always be followed in the order stated.



Hope this helps



Hope this helps
 
I read the Z10 mentioned. I'd like to add that I'm not real impressed with this stuff. I put some on a rag and wiped it on my seat as I usually do.

It left marks where I wiped it like I squirted it right on it & dried. I didn't even notice until I was driving that day. I never had that happen before.
 
WaxManRonnie said:
I read the Z10 mentioned. I'd like to add that I'm not real impressed with this stuff. I put some on a rag and wiped it on my seat as I usually do.

It left marks where I wiped it like I squirted it right on it & dried. I didn't even notice until I was driving that day. I never had that happen before.
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Blame the marks problem to its alkalinity (reads pH 8.8 on a pH meter).



If you are also using alkaline cleaners prior to this treatment and conditioning, the pH value of the leather surface has shifted and reach its threshold of pH intolerance.



To solve this marking problem of alkaline pH over-exposure an “Acidifier� with a pH value of 2.0 will reduce or eliminate the brightening marks.



Otherwise an alternative leather-safe (pH 3-5) system products will NEVER give you Marks!





Roger Koh

Leather Doctor®
 
Roger Koh said:
===



Have you seen the link to the samples yet? No - please PM me with it. :ca



Like to check the severity of this problem.



Question:



You said it is a gray aniline leathers - I have yet to see aniline leathers in gray!



You are correct. I spoke to my local leather rep and it is a coated leather. Sorry for the confusion.



When you tried with LM strong cleaner what tools or material you used along with the removing process (sponge, brush, pads, etc) ?



I applied the Strong Cleaner with a foamer by cotton towel in an isolated spot. I then applied it to a horse hair hand brush and did probably 3 or so applications. I scrubbed gently in multiple directions. I then did a test spot with a toothbrush(stiffer) and same results.



Did the leather darkens or remain the same color when wet?

Stayed the same color....i.e. Coated



Did you tried the entire stain areas or part of it.

Yes. After the initial test spot I did a large portion of the entire stain. I don't think I did the entire area though and their isn't any difference between the two areas.



Without any success - do you mean looks the same the before and after?

Yes, the stain didn't get any lighter.



Do you think, by chance this cushion can be removed and send to me?

That might be a challenge. Probably not at this point.







Do you have any success with “Blue Jean Dye Transfer Stain Removal� in the other occasions?



Nope. I've never been able to totally remove discoloration/transer from blue jean, leather coats, or tire imprints. Open for suggestions though....



Roger Koh

Leather Doctor®
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judyb said:
Hi David



Looking at the photos I would hesitate to say it is definitely an aniline leather. Generally speaking leather of that colour will have been pigmented as you rarely get aniline leathers that colour.



If it has (as it appears) got some type of surface coating on it the process to follow would be:



Maxi Cleaner

Alcohol Cleaner



These two stages will remove any dye transfer that can be safely removed without damaging the finish on the leather. 'Bleaches' should not be used as they will almost certainly cause damage.



If these two stages do not remove the dye then a very light pigment coating can be applied to recolour. This would not require a full recolour as long as you had a pigment that matched the leather.



As with all these type of processes they are not cleaning processes. They are what we call technical processes that require the knowledge to use stage by stage products which may eventually lead to recolouring. The process may be enough at any stage and should always be followed in the order stated.



Hope this helps



Hope this helps
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I'm starting to believe you are correct. I've spoken to the Leather Master's Tech Rep and they've basically said that if Strong Cleaner didn't lighten it, it's in need of recoloring. They also confirmed it was a coated leather too. The stain was only 2 days old when I cleaned it and was hoping I would have had luck removing it, but appearantly no such luck.





Anyone know of a Leather Technician in S. Florida that can handle a very demanding client? It needs to be a permanant repair and brought back to factory specifications. I'll PM Quality Leather and see if he's coming down any time soon.
 
We have had many many successes with the methods I have described for dye transfer removal - LM Strong Cleaner is not the most effective of cleaners on this problem so you would need to try something stronger. Then alcohol cleaner which is about the strongest cleaner you can use without doing damage to the finish.



The problem is that each case is a different problem as there are so many types of finish and so many dyes that there are infinite combinations of the two so there is no one solution that will always work. This is what needs to be understood about the difference between 'cleaning' and 'restoration' when dealing with leather problems.



Who did you speak with at LM?



Cheers

Judy
 
No it has to be a pure alcohol. This is not mixed with water and is not a rubbing alcohol which has an oily content..

Once you have tried this step and it does not work then the dye has been aggressive and the finsih has allowed it to soak in too far - this is when recolouring becomes necessary. We would always rather restore than recolour and it is very important to remove whatever dye is on the surface before recolouring which is why we always do these 2 steps first.

Always use Ultra Protect on a leather of this colour as it will inhibit this problem from happening.



Hope this helps
 
David Fermani said:
Do you have any success with “Blue Jean Dye Transfer Stain Removal� in the other occasions?



Nope. I've never been able to totally remove discoloration/transer from blue jean, leather coats, or tire imprints. Open for suggestions though....

.
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If you have no past success on “Dye Transfer Stain Removal - Test this system out!



This is the recommended leather-safe system for General Dye Transfer Stains Removal from Leather Finish.



Step 1

Use a pH 2.2 Leather Degreaser.

It’s for instance removal of surface stains much faster than the slower working of the pH 7.7 Leather Prep.

When it’s no longer showing any transfer to towel; rinse and inspect.

The dye removal may end here.

Otherwise move to the next step for penetrated stains.



Step 2

Use a pH 7.7 Leather Prep.

Penetrated stains requires longer dwell-time and this sticky Leather Prep will slowly penetrate, lubricate and suspense the dyes.

It is design to dwell on stains even up to 3 days – the longer the better result it gets as the dyes continuously being suspended through the active chemical reaction.

And when periodic (one, four or overnight) extraction with rag shows clean; rinse and inspect.

The dye removal may end here.

Otherwise with unsatisfactorily evident traces of dyes still remains, move to the next step.



Step 3

Use a pH 11.0 Leather Protein Remover.

Due to its higher pH it helps to break bonds and release penetrated dyes by making the unwanted dyes more fugitive.

Apply, dwell, agitate and extract until towel shows clean and rinse.

The dye removal may end here.

Otherwise move on to the next step.



Step 4

Use a leather-safe pH 3.5 Leather Bleach with a pH 1.3 Leather Bleach Booster.

If there is remaining trace of dyes then the leather bleach will probably remove any remaining traces.

As the pH 1.3 Leather Bleach Booster helps accelerate the bleaching process.

Apply, dwell, rinse and inspect when dry.

The stubborn dye should stop dead here, otherwise there is another step to go with a pH 10.3 Leather Bleach to be used with cautions!





Note:

The pH 7.7 Leather Prep removes the main bulk of the stains in most of these general dye transfer cases.





Let’s check if this Water-Based Dye Stain Removal System is Safe?



When you add up all the pH values in each sequence and divide them up you get an average pH value of 4.18.



And you can always Google the pH value of leather to verify it, as I often quoted the average pH value of leather is from 3 to 5.



This leather-safe system is design to remove the tenacious dye stains safely before resorting to “Color Refinish� it.



And in most cases a matching Topcoat is recommended without the need to recolor.







Roger Koh

Leather Doctor®
 
Well I got my LTT products today. Ordered the Auto Ultra 150 Kit. Ordered it May 6th, got an email May 11th saying it shipped, and just got it today May 17th. Probably going to use the Auto Ultra Maintain on my car today.



Does the Ultra Protect or Ultra Maintain protect from UV and or heat?
 
The Ultra Protect has UV protector in it. As the Ultra Maintain also has the protector in it it has a degree of UV protection but obviously not as much as using the full strength protector.



When you say heat protection - the action of the heat will be to change the moisture level of the leather - as the products are all water based this will rehydrate the leather so guarding against the heat!!!



Hope this helps and hope you enjoy using the products



Cheers

Judyb
 
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