Interesting discussion about detailing: Paintless Dent Forum

I've been saying that people undercharge for years! It's not good business to undercharge, when you sell your services so low you sort of make yourself look cheap.
 
I have a really hard time dealing with customers sometimes. They seem to have a serious disparity in the value of our services.



I have people come to me who want something extreme, and expect perfection for $150. Now I am sure that some people will consider $150 a good days work, a full day of detailing is worth far more than that. It is a skill when done correctly. It isn't something that just anybody can do.



The only way that I deal with this is to explain the difference between a true detailer, and a car washer. A car washer will clean a car for $150, a detailer will not. Now the flip side of this is that a car washer won't stand behind their work, whereas a detailer will.



All we can do is draw a line to differentiate between ourselves, and the car washers. They are the ones who happily take underpaid jobs and return with substandard results. It is a tarnishment to ourselves and our industry to have them under the same name, when the results are so drastically different. Once you can explain that differentiation, getting paid commensorate with the effort put into the vehicle isn't really all that difficult.
 
Agreed! You MUST educate your customers! I remember detailing a Lincoln one day, just doing a quick wax on it that the owner wanted. This guy came up and asked what we charged and I said $130 for this job and he said , "WHAT?! I can go down to so and so Detailing and get it done for $75!" I just chuckled and told him he probably should do that. I hate those guys that come in their work trucks filled with scratches down to the primer and point them all out and tell you they want you to take care of those for a wax job.
 
I actually tell that to people all the time.



They call and ask for a quote, I tell them that I don't give quotes without seeing the car. I have heard numerous times that my policy was stupid, that so and so said they would do it for that much, blah blah blah. If they want to throw someone else's price in my face, then let them do the job. I don't have a problem with that.



If they are looking at getting their car detailed as a bottom line price rather than an end result, it isn't a customer that I would want anyway. My customers say what result they want, and I quote a price based on that expectation. I have no issue telling them upfront that I am more expensive than most, but that I deliver. I have yet to ever have someone who accepted my quote not be completely satisfied with the return on their money.
 
Oh we had that here. I had to raise my rates a little (instead of a full all out detail for $150 I now charge $200 with full paint correction and such) and you have some people that will just moan and groan about it. Guy came in this morning and started talking about the shop down the road.... I basically (as professionally as I could) told him to go on down there and see if he's really happy with the work he gets done and after that come back and see me. I make sure people see my work I take pleanty of pics before and after and show them. And my real customers have no issues with my prices.
 
Man we've had this discussion so many times. The problem, like in every industry, is there are hacks willing to do it for less, and most people don't know the difference. Find your niche and charge accordingly. Thanks for the link over there, it was a good read.
 
AppliedColors said:
Synopsis: Detailing is a lot of work for little money. Detailers undercharge and customers underpay.
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Maybe to some people, detailing is a lot of work for little money. But then, those detailers are probably already out of business. And those that have gone out of business will also be the first to tell you that they undercharged and customers underpayed. Now for the rest of the successful detailing business owners who have been out there for a number of years, they know that in order to stay in business and make a reasonable profit they cannot afford to work for little money. Hey, one man's ceiling is another man's floor.
 
Mirror finish congrats on 21 years!! Incredible. I remember when I had a seal coating business. I charged a customer 225$ and they got all upset and instead went with someone that knocked on their door for 75.00$. What they got in the end was a driveway coated in old automobile oil. Then the town made them pay to have it cleaned up. I made sure I drove past that house as much as I could just to smile at the people as they sat on their porch.



Every detail I do I feel I have undercut myself. BUT, I get an extreme amount of satisfaction from the end product.
 
[quote name='fergnation']Mirror finish congrats on 21 years!! Incredible.
Reminds me of the time a few years back when one of my customers, who I had not heard from in a year or two called and wanted me to detail his boat again. So I made the appointment and while I was there finishing up two days worth of work on his boat, he told me the story of how he actually had someone else detail the boat the year before. He proceeded to explain how the detail shop, where he had taken the boat never even lifted off the snap-on front cover. Not even to remove the crumbled leaves and wash underneath, let alone polish and wax the fiberglass under there. Oh yes, he also mentioned that the price the detail shop had charged was only one half of what I was charging. And added that he once again had learned the 'you-get-what-you-pay-for lesson the hard way.



Imagine, a professional detail shop and they could not even remove a simple canvas cover and clean underneath. Needless to say they did not stay in business very long. Now when I drive by I usually see empty bays and someone out there washing down the pavement. Hey, at least they win the prize for having the cleanest place in town.
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AP2TUDE said:
If they are looking at getting their car detailed as a bottom line price rather than an end result, it isn't a customer that I would want anyway.
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Words to live by!



So many businesses (not just detailing) stress low price more than quality. When even an average car is $20,000+, why would you settle for low quality to save a few bucks maintaining the finish and interior of you car?
 
I had a guy call me last night about getting his car detailed. He had moved out of the area for 5 years and recently returned. I told him what I would charge him (he's kind of anal about his cars and they are always kept fairly clean) and he stated..



The last time you detailed it, it was only $xxx dollars, why the big jump in price?
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I then asked him if he was paying the same prices at the gas pumps, the same prices at the grocery store, the same amount in real estate and income taxes.... his answer?
"no".
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I then said "I think you answered your own question...." :grinno:
 
Appliedcolors - I think you need to enlighten the crew on the powerful profits in bumper repair.



I remember outsourcing my lot bumper work to a guy with a mobile solution and giving him $120 per bumper. If the work took him 2 hours, it was too long. I'd call him 1x per month and have about 10 bumpers waiting for him. I used to mix the colors as I had 2 mixing systems on site, most of the mobile guys are color blind. I just asked him to prep, spray, and finish the jobs.

I couldn't tie up my booths for a single bumper.
 
jsatek said:
Appliedcolors - I think you need to enlighten the crew on the powerful profits in bumper repair.



I remember outsourcing my lot bumper work to a guy with a mobile solution and giving him $120 per bumper. If the work took him 2 hours, it was too long. I'd call him 1x per month and have about 10 bumpers waiting for him. I used to mix the colors as I had 2 mixing systems on site, most of the mobile guys are color blind. I just asked him to prep, spray, and finish the jobs.

I couldn't tie up my booths for a single bumper.
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This was the conclusion of the discussion on the PDR forum: detailing profits are thin...reconditioning profits are fat.



You don't even need to provide these services yourself:



Paintless Dent Repair (About $175 per job)

Bumper Repair (About $225 per job)

Windshield Repair (About $35 per job)

Scratch Touchup (About $35 per job)

Vinyl/Leather/Plastic Repair (About $100 per job)

Headlight Repair (About $40 per job)



90% of the cars we detail have one of the above problems. We successfully upsell at least one of these services on 60% of the cars we service. Our shop does all but PDR onsite, but smaller shops can simply refer the customer on to a local company and collect a referral fee of $20 - $40.



Windshield repair can be added for about $600. Scratch repair for $800 - $3000. Headlight repair can be done with wetsanding and compounding (search Autopia for instructions). PDR could take $10k and a year to learn. Bumpers: $10k and a year. Interior: $4k and a year.



Reconditioning has actually kept our shop profitable season after season. We can keep our detailing prices competitive and know that our rarer services will add significant money to each job we accept.



Remember that detailing services are common and competitive. Adding services that your competition doesn't puts you in a less competitive space and allows you more control over your prices and income.
 
Picus said:
Man we've had this discussion so many times. The problem, like in every industry, is there are hacks willing to do it for less, and most people don't know the difference. Find your niche and charge accordingly. Thanks for the link over there, it was a good read.
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Exactly, not only that, consider a full fledged legitimate Detail business that is registered, taxes, insurance, liability, compensation, retirement, etc. It all mounts up to Detailing being by far one of the lowest profitability with the MOST work ethic. If you don't believe me, head to Mobileworks.



Sucks, but like always you absolutely need something to fall back on. Detailing for profit is a brutal BUSINESS.
 
Now see, I am going the opposite direction... In my market there are about 6 mobile guys that specialize in each of these catagories.. I was set up for everything and ive found that in my market folks want to use the guy that specializes in one particular area. What this area does not have is a serious top shelf detailer. SO I took my towels and buckets to the local Jag dlrshp and detailed a few of their cars.. They took one look and instantly gave me my own detailing bay and every trade in they take in. Within a year I am already considered the go to guy for this entire area.



This being said, the dlrshp is still a dlrshp, they get good work for about 100 a car but they refer a lot of high end clients who are happy to pay 250 or more for the same job. I also am the only guy in town who installs 3M paint protection film.. but that is a completely different story..$$:chuckle: $$
 
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