Holograms What did I do wrong

[Accumulator]

This is another reason why I am scared to use a rotary. It seems like it's really easy to mess up with in untrained hands.

Eh...I wouldn't let the hologram issues on this thread dissuade you from using a rotary. Removing holograms is easier than correcting most forms of marring, and the rotary gets you to the "just holograms" level nice and fast.



Using the appropriate pads and products, the rotary can be very, very safe and save you a lot of time.



I'm more afraid to use products like 106Ff that can result in the reappearance of holograms long after you think they're gone..now *that* is something that I'd worry about.

well i had to go back and use the flex to the holograms out. i tried and tried but couldnt get the holograms out with the rotary.



maybe i just need practice or different pads or something?? i'm kinda bummed

While finishing by rotary is getting a lot of attention here these days, it's not something that everyone can do. I've never done it to my satisfaction; I always finish by Cyclo.



Last I heard Mike Phillips still finishes with the Meguiar's Random Orbital and that's pretty good company to be in



I've heard of random orbitals leaving an inferior-to-rotary finish like you had with your Flex, but I've never seen it with my Cyclo. Now *that* is something you might want to find a solution to. So just removing the holograms via Flex diminished the finish huh? Wonder if you might've needed another final burnishing step (with the Flex), something milder than the process that removed the holograms. My final burnishing on certain vehicles is very, very close to functionally nonabrasive and is much more gentle than my hologram-removal step.

 

[imported_advs1]

i'm very satisfied with using the rotary, then the flex. i went back over the entire car with the flex and some CG final polish and that seemed to bring back the depth the rotary gave me. this was on my DD, its a blue onyx pearl scion. now the pearl really pops in the sun.



and yes the rotary was very fast at removing most of the defects as opposed to the flex. not knocking the flex, just trying out different things and trying to cut total time down. i was able to do the entire car with both steps in about 4hrs. i think thats acceptable with the results achieved. it was 100% because it was my first time with the rotary and didnt want to damaged the paint. next step will be to do a car to as close to perfect as possible.

 

[Binzes]

Eh...I wouldn't let the hologram issues on this thread dissuade you from using a rotary. Removing holograms is easier than correcting most forms of marring, and the rotary gets you to the "just holograms" level nice and fast.



Using the appropriate pads and products, the rotary can be very, very safe and save you a lot of time.



I'm more afraid to use products like 106Ff that can result in the reappearance of holograms long after you think they're gone..now *that* is something that I'd worry about.

:think:





Well I have a Dewalt 849, a Makita somethingorother and an assortment of pads at my disposal. I might just practice on the girlfriends car :waxing:

 

[Accumulator]

i'm very satisfied with using the rotary, then the flex. i went back over the entire car with the flex and some CG final polish and that seemed to bring back the depth the rotary gave me..

Ah, OK, glad it turned out good.

Well I have a Dewalt 849, a Makita somethingorother and an assortment of pads at my disposal. I might just practice on the girlfriends car

As long as you give it some thought and keep thinking during the work, I expect you'll find it's not all that scary once you start doing it.

 

[SuperBee364]

Accumulator, I can now pronounce that red finishing wave foam and 3M's Ultrafina is "Accumulator proof" for finishing down hologram free.



Greg Nichols and I just finished a black Bentley yesterday that had *the very softest* paint I have ever seen. After we finished correcting and polishing it yesterday, we did a conventional wash on it to prep it for RMG/LSP. It suffered *severe* (no kidding, it really was severe) washing induced marring. You could actually see the texture of the WW drying towels we used in the paint. We ended up having to remove the washing-induced marring with yet another pass of UF on the red pads. It finished out completely hologram free (as it did before we marred the paint by washing it). I'm convinced that UF will finish hologram free on the softest paints. It also has the ability to remove holograms on most paints. Really hard paints might need something with a bit more teeth for hologram removal, but I can say with almost 100% confidence that you ain't gonna *cause* holos with UF and a red pad.



I'll never do another detail on a black Bentley again. The paint is just stupid soft. Even softer than jet black BMW. It truly was a nightmare.

 

[Greg Nichols]

^^^

not to highjack the thread, but I was very impressed with UF.



Yes, this bentley was a PITA. We'll be posting pics when I recover from my labors.



GREG

 

[jw]

What's the best way to see if the holograms are gone without getting out in the direct sunlight. I had a 500 watt halogen and I didn't see the holograms.

 

[SuperBee364]

A 3M Sun Gun will show holograms (at least, so I've heard), but I would guess that it wouldn't show the really light grams that the sun is capable of showing. Unfortunately, there's no *true* substitute for the sun when it comes to seeing grams.

 

[Scottwax]

I started with Meguiars #105 cut about 20% with Optimum Polish using a Meguiars yellow foam polishing pad (was removing heavy water spotting) and it did a great job removing the defects but left noticable buffer trails. Since this is somewhat soft Honda paint (2008 Accord), I followed with Optimum Polish @ 1200 rpm using a blue Soft Edge polishing pad (more like a finishing pad) which still left faint holograms. Finished it out with 3M Ultrafina using a blue Ultrafina pad @ 1000/1800/1000 rpms. Pretty happy with the results, my customer was absolutely floored.

 

[imported_advs1]

wow wish i could finish off that nice with a rotary. right now i only have CG stuff to work with so its trial and error. but i got tired of the error and broke out the flex. lol

 

[SuperBee364]

Wow, Scott, that is truly a *flawless* finish.



And advs1, I bet you could get gram free finishes with UF and a no-bite pad, too. UF is just wonderful stuff.

 

[Accumulator]

SuperBee364 and Greg Nichols- Hmm...what with the red pad/Ultrafina I'm running out of excuses! Well, other than my general preference for the Cyclos



Wonder how Accumulator-proof the red pad would be with 1Z HG :think:

What's the best way to see if the holograms are gone without getting out in the direct sunlight. I had a 500 watt halogen and I didn't see the holograms.

-AND-

A 3M Sun Gun will show holograms (at least, so I've heard), but I would guess that it wouldn't show the really light grams that the sun is capable of showing. Unfortunately, there's no *true* substitute for the sun when it comes to seeing grams.

Yep, gotta have natural sunlight, and in some cases it has to be a *JUST* the right angle too. On the Yukon, my wife and I had to work together for a *LONG* time to spot the faint holograms that were left after I did the best I could in the shop's lighting. Some of those holograms were only visible when the panel was transitioning from full sun to partial shade, it was very tricky to do that particular inspection.



The lighting I tried in my shop included my new 3M Sun Gun too. It works for moderate holograms, *IF* you do things right (no, it's not easy to spot 'em with that light by a long shot), but it absolutely will not show very light holograms on metallic paint. Even when I knew where they were, I simply couldn't see that "fleeting shadow" effect that indicates holograms under artificial lighting.



The Sun Gun is better than nothing if you don't mind the expense. At least you can spot *some* holograms with it, which is more than I can say for other types of artificial lighting. But that expense...eh...all-in-all I wish I'd saved my money, and I'm nobody's idea of a tightwad But I just had to try it myself, in *my* shop, on a known-quantity sample (the Yukon really was just perfect for that), so I'd know first-hand how good/not it is.

 

[SuperBee364]

Wonder how Accumulator-proof the red pad would be with 1Z HG :think:

I tried HG and red foam on the Bentley. It was nasty. It looked like it had just been freshly compounded afterwards. Greg and I couldn't believe how poorly the HG finished off on this particular car.

 

[Accumulator]

SuperBee364- Eh..that sounds like the kind of stupid-soft clear that I'd sell a vehicle over. Good to know that Bentleys are like that (even if I am sorry to hear it).

 

[SuperBee364]

SuperBee364- Eh..that sounds like the kind of stupid-soft clear that I'd sell a vehicle over. Good to know that Bentleys are like that (even if I am sorry to hear it).

As beautiful as the Bentley is, I would *never* own one just for how soft the clear is. Zero orange peel, though.