:: Help Me Win Concours :: Part II (Exterior Paint Process)

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ahheck01

New member
I've established a great checklist in Part I: the Master Checklist. I've categorized everything by how they're treated. For Part II, we're addressing the following items on the checklist:



Exterior:



Front Bumper

Nosepanel

Top of Hood (surface)

Driver/Passenger front quarterpanels

Driver/Passenger front doors

D/P rear doors

D/P rear quarterpanels

Trunk Lid

M5 Lip

D/P Sideskirts

Rear Panel (surrounds bottom of trunklid)

Rear Bumper

Side View Mirrors (body)

Exterior B Pillars

Roof

Sunroof

D/P Front Door Jambs

D/P Rear Door Jambs



After a thorough initial cleaning of the door jambs, I want to treat them the same as the rest of the paint for continuity. After all, it's the same paint and a continuation of the exposed panels, it's just hidden most of the time.



So, Now for the process. I need to figure out the absolutely BEST way to make everything in the above list immaculate - better than new.



The Process:

- Thorough wash/Dry

- Clay

- Wash/Dry

- 3M FI 2 with a moderate cut pad on the PC (speed 5)

- Klasse AIO with a mild cut pad on the PC (speed 5)

- Klasse AIO with a finishing pad on the PC (speed 2)

- Klasse Sealant Glaze by hand with foam applicator (3 layers)

- P21S/S100 Carnauba Wax

- Thorough Wash/Dry a few days later, followed by another coat of wax

- Quick Detailer





Now, I know you recommended a glaze. Where in the process would that go? What steps would it eliminate? What products would it work best with? Which glaze do you most recommend? Feel free to elaborate on any of the steps for me.



Thanks again!



-Evan
 
That combination will work, however, it's a bit dated. There are much better finishing polishes than Klasse AIO, IMHO. Also, the Klasse Twins won't mix well with most glazes, and are a major PITA to work with. They do have excellent durability for a winter car, but for maximum look, I'd skip the sealant and use carnuba only. If I were going to prep a car for a show, this is what I'd do:



Wash with Meg's NXT

Clay

Hose off/Dry

Menzerna IP or Optimum Compound

Menzerna PO85RD or FPII

Clearkote Red Moose Glaze

Pinnacle Souveran (best overall look) or Poorboy's Blue Natty's (wettest) or FK1 Pink (also good) carnuba



Wash with a very mild shampoo (1z perls or similar, I'd stay away from NXT as it's harsh on carnubas) each day for the next week, add a coat of wax after each wash.



Make sure to tape off EVERYTHING before polishing. Seams, seals, around mirrors, emblems, etc. If you get polish in a crack it's a real job to remove, and judges are definetly going to pick up on it.



Also, I'd use Natural Look on the tires, rubber seals, etc, as shortly as possible before the show. It'll give everything a new appearance without the tacky look.



Good luck on the show,

Tim
 
themightytimmah said:
That combination will work, however, it's a bit dated. There are much better finishing polishes than Klasse AIO, IMHO. Also, the Klasse Twins won't mix well with most glazes, and are a major PITA to work with. They do have excellent durability for a winter car, but for maximum look, I'd skip the sealant and use carnuba only. If I were going to prep a car for a show, this is what I'd do:



Wash with Meg's NXT

Clay

Hose off/Dry

Menzerna IP or Optimum Compound

Menzerna PO85RD or FPII

Clearkote Red Moose Glaze

Pinnacle Souveran (best overall look) or Poorboy's Blue Natty's (wettest) or FK1 Pink (also good) carnuba



Wash with a very mild shampoo (1z perls or similar, I'd stay away from NXT as it's harsh on carnubas) each day for the next week, add a coat of wax after each wash.
Click to expand...

So essentially replace AIO with the glaze, and the sealant with a wax?
 
I always needed a finer, but still abrasive, polish after the FI-II. It doesn't leave a bad finish, but not one that was ever good enough for me. I'd try to find the discontinued (but still commonly available) PI-III MG (05937).
 
for wheels I just figured I'd clean, AIO/SG them while they're off the car at the same time I'm doing wheel wells.



I have forever black for my black trim.



I'd like to settle on a glaze and a wax. Whatever you guys think is best for concours...
 
Ahheck01 said:
I'd like to settle on a glaze and a wax. Whatever you guys think is best for concours...
Click to expand...



I think you should take accumulators advice and PREP your paint first with the right polishes and when any and all blemishes are removed THEN worry about glazes and waxes (if you even want to wax it) as a lot of car show attendees use just a glaze during the show.

I would suggest buying some halogen work lights, flourescent lights and of course direct sunlight to evaluate your paint from every angle...heck buy a jewelers loop to inspect your paint close up to make sure it is outstanding before applying a glaze and/or wax. RMG, VM, megs #3 and #7, menzerna FG are glazes that popped into my head as being good. If you want to go with a wax topper I am sure that Turtle wax will look good over a very well prepped surface. But there is the ever loved souveran that seems to be the reigning king
 
Best is always a relative term and subject to personal opinions and subjective factors. Having covered myself with that disclaimer ;) I'd say #7 is the best looking glaze (not the most user-friendly product in the world though) and it's time-tested in concours competition. I'd top it with Souveran myself.



For a loupe, search for my post about the great 15X one I bought last year.
 
Accumulator said:
Best is always a relative term and subject to personal opinions and subjective factors. Having covered myself with that disclaimer ;) I'd say #7 is the best looking glaze (not the most user-friendly product in the world though) and it's time-tested in concours competition. I'd top it with Souveran myself.



For a loupe, search for my post about the great 15X one I bought last year.
Click to expand...



Looking at the reviews for #7, I'm a bit scared about the ease of use. Perhaps a second recommendation? Sorry... :think:



So, as of now, he's my Exterior Paint Process for my Arctic Silver car - please critique it!:



Wash with NXT

Dry

Clay

Wash with NXT

Hose off/Dry

Menzerna IP

Menzerna FPII

Clearkote Red Moose Glaze

Pinnacle Souveran





So, let's break it down into futher detail:



Wash with NXT:



Two bucket method. What ratio NXT to water? Where does wheel wells fit in the process?





Dry:



Using an absorber and a regular cotton towel (to pick up what the absorber left on glass), drying top to bottom.





Clay:



Any particular Clay I should use? My process is to do one bodypanel at a time, top to bottom, folding the clay often. I plan to clay the glass, too.





Menzerna IP:



Never used it before, but assume it's similar to FI3. Probably an orange pad (light cut) at PC speed 5 or 6? Any special tips for applying this particular compound?





Menzerna FP:



Never used it before. Probably use a white pad (polishing pad) at a PC speed of 5 or 6? Any special tips for this polish?





Clearkote Red Moose Glaze:



Not yet completely sold on using this for my glaze. I've never used a glaze with fillers (only used KSG before), and am very open to different ones, and different methods of application. Please share you tip, instructions, and experiences with me!





Pinnacle Souveran:



I'm not sure how the apply-by-fingers method is viewed here. It's recommended in the articles on autopia.org. Seems like a safe method, though I don't want to screw up my glaze, and I don't want skin oils to interfere? What do you all think? Best method of application?







Thanks in advance!
 
Alternatives to #7 are any other manufacturers' glazes and the following from Meg's (easier to hardest, just IMO) #5/#3/#81.



Wash- No biggie how you mix up shampoo. I myself only wash with a foamgun.



Dry- I wouldn't touch paint with a dry cotton towel lest you instill micromarring. I'd use the softest WWMFs you can find.



Clay- I cut it into small pieces and pitch them when contaminated. Use lots of lube and virtually no pressure. Sometimes you have to fold/knead/replace the clay after a single contact with the contaminated paint. Remember that it can turn into sandpaper if it gets contaminated with something abrasiv.



Polishes- If you use an orange pad I'd expect you to need something in between that and the FPII. Not that familiar with Menzerna polishes. Buff off with softest MFs.



For silver, I'd get numerous good light sources to inpect your work (I use fluorescent, incandescent- both ceiling mounted and hand held, halogen, and natural sunlight) and I like to also use magnification. The whole trick with silver is spotting the little imperfections that refract (as opposed to relfect) light.



RMG- Not familiar.



Souveran- I just use a foam applicatior, works fine even on the softest lacquer. No need for the fingertip stuff unless you want to do it that way. Buff off with softest MFs. Put it on very thin and don't be afraid to let it dry before you buff it off.
 
^^ that is good advice from a VERY meticulous person when it comes to paint! Regarding the menzerna polishes FPII and the new one that came out (I am a little out dated on the new numbers and such something like PO85 should be a great way to finish off the polishing steps.

RMG is a very easy glaze to use compared to #7, but #7 is hard to beat. There is steps from Mike Phillips from meguiars on how to remove the product in the hall of fame ( I think, search will be your friend).
 
So, I'm thinking of replacing the MFP with VM, and add the RMG on top of that.



So, on a silver daily driver that won't see a garage (only a car cover when not in use), is souveran my best bet? What less expensive, slightly more durable waxes are there? With silver, depth is almost more important than wetness...



Thanks!



-Evan
 
Ahheck01 said:
So, on a silver daily driver that won't see a garage (only a car cover when not in use), is souveran my best bet? What less expensive, slightly more durable waxes are there? With silver, depth is almost more important than wetness...
Click to expand...



Most any LSP will be more durable than Souveran ;) I only use that on garage queens.



For a vehicle being subjected to those conditions I wouldn't worry about subtle factors like "depth with silver". I'd worry about protection and thus would choose something like the Klasse twins (which I use on our silver minivan) or a wax from Collinite.



A few on/offs with the cover and you're probably gonna have micromarring anyhow.
 
Accumulator said:
Most any LSP will be more durable than Souveran ;) I only use that on garage queens.



For a vehicle being subjected to those conditions I wouldn't worry about subtle factors like "depth with silver". I'd worry about protection and thus would choose something like the Klasse twins (which I use on our silver minivan) or a wax from Collinite.



A few on/offs with the cover and you're probably gonna have micromarring anyhow.
Click to expand...

Well, but I am participating in concours... should I use souveran just for that?



-Evan
 
I would still use the Souveran, but I don't quite get the idea of keeping a concours competition vehicle outside under a cover. I knew somebody who it it that way with a Jag XJC (parked *and detailed* it outside and still won her class at the national level), but that's sure doing things the hard way and the Jag Club judging rules are kinda, uhm, sympathetic in some ways. Consider that many concours cars are basically *never* exposed to the light of day (much less driven) except for purposes of showing. No, I don't like that approach, but it's the way things are and depending on the contest venue you might be competing with a lot of better-than-new vehicles.



Or *not*, in which case disregard all the above except the "use the Souveran".
 
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