Rave'nGTi
New member
excellent reply 
Synthetic/Polymer rant found on other forum... thoughts?
- Thread starter Rave'nGTi
- Start date
Nick T.
New member
Statements like this from various vendors is what has made me stop buying or recommending Meguiar’s or Lexol products. If they feel the need to <S>blow smoke up my a</S><S>ss</S> mislead me in an attempt to lure me into buying their products, it makes me question both their ethics and the quality of their products!Acura_RL said:
VetteToVair
New member
Nick T. said:
They can blow smoke anywhere they want, but i will still use their products. I still dont understand why some people boycott product lines because of things like this. The only person who really loses is you:nixweiss
(Not aimed solely at Nick T)
Nick T.
New member
Well stranger99, it’s like this. I grew up in a small town in California in the 1940s where everybody knew everybody else. If a person was dishonest (or misleading) the word soon got around and they were shunned until they changed their ethics. For a business person this meant that to stay in business they were forced to be ethical due to the pressures of the community. I’m honest and ethical, and I expect that the people and businesses that I deal with respond in a like fashion.stanger99 said:
Maybe in this twenty-first century morals and ethics have lost their importance, but if they have, it’s the fault of each individual who fails to insist on moral and ethical behavior on both sides of all of his dealings.
I don’t understand how I lose if I don’t use a product sold by a company that lies to me or attempts to mislead me. If I allowed Lexol to lead me into believing that Vinylex has the equivalent of an ultraviolet SPF rating of 60 with their prominent display of “DH-60 UV SCREEN� in their advertising, on their web site, and on the Vinylex bottle, and I relied on Vinylex to provide UV protection, then I’d be the loser!
By buying or promoting products from vendors that lie or mislead, a person is only encouraging them (and others) to lie and mislead even more!
VetteToVair
New member
Isn't there a thread going around here somewhere about how none of these products(whether dash protectants or sealants) can provide any significant UV protection? So wouldn't 303 and many other manufacturers be guilty of misleading the consumer as well? We can't boycott all of the manufacturers for implying that we are protecting our babies. If anybody can find the thread/posts i'm thinking about, feel free to post a link
I think the thread is just called uv protection. Intermezzo had an interesting post at the end.
I think the thread is just called uv protection. Intermezzo had an interesting post at the end.
safetyman2010
New member
stanger99 said:Isn't there a thread going around here somewhere about how none of these products(whether dash protectants or sealants) can provide any significant UV protection? So wouldn't 303 and many other manufacturers be guilty of misleading the consumer as well? We can't boycott all of the manufacturers for implying that we are protecting our babies. If anybody can find the thread/posts i'm thinking about, feel free to post a link
I think the thread is just called uv protection. Intermezzo had an interesting post at the end.
I may be able to interject some commentary on this subject because it seems to be coming up a lot on this forum and others. Remember to take all advice posted about any product bu a manufacturer or competitor with a grain of salt. How many products out there have come and gone in the last 10 years? Anyone here remember "Nathan's Liquid Lustre"? There are no magic formulas or secrets in this industry people. Almost all the products out there are exactly the same as the competitions with some minor tweaking of the formulas. This is not rocket science. Cut through all the marketing jargon and hype and use good products from the reputable companies using proper processes and procedures and you will garner excellent results whether using Meguiars or Zaino or whatever. Sometimes people make detailing far too complicated than it needs to be. END OF RANT.
Nick T.
New member
ShineShop hit the nail on the head. Take all “facts� read on the internet with a grain of salt. I recently posted a long rant about this very subject here on Autopia!
Here are my “facts� about car care products and UV screening:
Being concerned about UV damage on my roadster which has less than 150 miles of top up driving, I decided to do some research. I started by emailing all the well known vendors of plastic care products inquiring about the amount of UV screening provided by their products. Some of the responses were hilarious (the Meguiar’s tech person inadvertently sent to me what was supposed to be a forward to his supervisor saying, “Help, this guy’s using big words on me.�), one was absolutely straight forward and to the point (Plexus said, “We provide zero UV screening.�), but most required several email and/or telephone exchanges. With Meguiar’s and Lexol the conversations kept moving up to higher levels of management, and they were both very evasive and I was lied to by Lexol. Lexol only backed off from there false statements when I asked if their statements were for publication. Their final statement (for publication) was, “Vinylex provides some UV protection.� 303 eventually pointed me to lab testing that showed 303 AP to provide more than the equivalent of SPF-40 (98%+) UV blockage.
In the course of all this I learned a lot about UV screening and some new terms such as para-aminobenzoic acid (PABA), Octyldimethyl PABA, and Benzophenone-3. Most of which I promptly forgot. Since I was doing this research purely for my own benefit in helping to choose products for use on my own car I didn’t bother to save the emails nor did I document the phone conversations. For this reason the quotes above are only approximations of what was actually said. I did post “cut and paste� copies of some of the emails on Roadfly’s detailing board while this was an ongoing project, so if you want initial verification that’s one possible starting point, along with doing your own research. Oh, and one more thing - I did find out the testing for UV blockage across the UV spectrum is a rather expensive process, far beyond anything that we as end users could afford to do.
(rant=ON)
It pisses me off to hear people defending unethical behavior! That’s how we end up with people like Gray Davis as governor of California. If you want to flame me, feel free to do so, but please do it via private email or PM. No need to clutter the Autopia forums with flames!.
(rant=OFF)
Here are my “facts� about car care products and UV screening:
Being concerned about UV damage on my roadster which has less than 150 miles of top up driving, I decided to do some research. I started by emailing all the well known vendors of plastic care products inquiring about the amount of UV screening provided by their products. Some of the responses were hilarious (the Meguiar’s tech person inadvertently sent to me what was supposed to be a forward to his supervisor saying, “Help, this guy’s using big words on me.�), one was absolutely straight forward and to the point (Plexus said, “We provide zero UV screening.�), but most required several email and/or telephone exchanges. With Meguiar’s and Lexol the conversations kept moving up to higher levels of management, and they were both very evasive and I was lied to by Lexol. Lexol only backed off from there false statements when I asked if their statements were for publication. Their final statement (for publication) was, “Vinylex provides some UV protection.� 303 eventually pointed me to lab testing that showed 303 AP to provide more than the equivalent of SPF-40 (98%+) UV blockage.
In the course of all this I learned a lot about UV screening and some new terms such as para-aminobenzoic acid (PABA), Octyldimethyl PABA, and Benzophenone-3. Most of which I promptly forgot. Since I was doing this research purely for my own benefit in helping to choose products for use on my own car I didn’t bother to save the emails nor did I document the phone conversations. For this reason the quotes above are only approximations of what was actually said. I did post “cut and paste� copies of some of the emails on Roadfly’s detailing board while this was an ongoing project, so if you want initial verification that’s one possible starting point, along with doing your own research. Oh, and one more thing - I did find out the testing for UV blockage across the UV spectrum is a rather expensive process, far beyond anything that we as end users could afford to do.
(rant=ON)
It pisses me off to hear people defending unethical behavior! That’s how we end up with people like Gray Davis as governor of California. If you want to flame me, feel free to do so, but please do it via private email or PM. No need to clutter the Autopia forums with flames!.
(rant=OFF)
VetteToVair
New member
Nick T. said:
Nobody has flamed you, Mr T. If I dont think a comment is fair, then I will respond on the public forum so all can benefit. If others dont agree with what i have to say, at least their opinions are formed from more than one point of view. I don't consider my posts clutter. No one is being uncivil.
Back on topic, i still haven't seen any scientific evidence suggesting that 303 blocks 98% of UV radiation while others dont block virtually any. I just want readers to know that what you propose is not accepted fact(as you are trying to present it). If you would like to prove me wrong, please do it with accepted facts.
Corey Bit Spank
Active member
You can always apply sunscreen to your dashboard. I'm sure it would give it that cheap, shiney, armor-all look. Hehe.
Nick T.
New member
1.) I did not accuse you of flaming me!stanger99 said:
2.) I did not say that your posts were clutter!
3.) I did not accuse you of being uncivil.
If you read things into my post that I didn’t actually say, then I apologize for not making myself more clear.
As for proving you wrong stranger99, I have no need to do that. I don’t particularly care what you believe or don’t believe. If you feel that it’s okay to support unethical vendors, that’s your business and no one else’s! If you’re willing to use an inferior product because their advertising hype has mislead you, that’s also your business and no one else’s! If you feel the need to prove me wrong in any of my statements, then feel free to do so - I gave you a couple of leads on how to do the verification. But, if you want me to see them you’ll need to send me a private email or PM since I won’t be following this thread any longer.
My apologies to all Autopians for the path that this thread has taken. As a general rule Autopia is the most cordial forum on the internet - when there is disagreement over an opinion, there usually is questioning, not challenging. I sincerely hope that it can stay that way.
VetteToVair
New member
Way to take the high road 
. I do agree that this discussion is over because your documentation is strangely not here. It would have been an invaluable source to the community. If you have it, why not post it? Then all can discuss it. (If anyone out there has seen this documentation or other solid evidence for anything, please PM me because i really am dying to know what's going on here.) It's not about what products you or i use. It's about you, not only vendors, potentially misleading autopians. I apologize if my unethical ways bother you.
I apologize to all for this thread getting off track. I'm done with it. If anyone has questions or info regarding the initial topic, they should probably start a new thread. Let's close this joint up before it gets any more useless.
P.S. Everybody use common sense when listening to vendors AND fellow consumers.
stanger(not stranger)99
. I do agree that this discussion is over because your documentation is strangely not here. It would have been an invaluable source to the community. If you have it, why not post it? Then all can discuss it. (If anyone out there has seen this documentation or other solid evidence for anything, please PM me because i really am dying to know what's going on here.) It's not about what products you or i use. It's about you, not only vendors, potentially misleading autopians. I apologize if my unethical ways bother you.I apologize to all for this thread getting off track. I'm done with it. If anyone has questions or info regarding the initial topic, they should probably start a new thread. Let's close this joint up before it gets any more useless.
P.S. Everybody use common sense when listening to vendors AND fellow consumers.
stanger(not stranger)99
quote:
Imagine his surprise when you go back to that amateur forum and tell him that 90% of body shop safe polishes (Meguiar's SMR, DACP, 3M SMR, FCRC) including the ones his body-shop buddy uses contain silica. (I think he's confusing silica with silicone)
Intermezzo
Man im glad my tyres contain Silica and not Silicone. Now that would be fun in the wet !!!
:rofl
Imagine his surprise when you go back to that amateur forum and tell him that 90% of body shop safe polishes (Meguiar's SMR, DACP, 3M SMR, FCRC) including the ones his body-shop buddy uses contain silica. (I think he's confusing silica with silicone)
Intermezzo
Man im glad my tyres contain Silica and not Silicone. Now that would be fun in the wet !!!
:rofl