My track day at Pocono Raceway! (with pictures)

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ZeusCGP

New member
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What an awesome time!

My coworkers husband, Doug, is a driving instructor for the NY Chapter of the BMW Car Club of America. A few weeks ago he was told me about a driving school that would take place at Pocono Raceway. I was totally in.

Thursday night I changed my brake pads (stock brakes/suspension), and arrived at the track Friday morning.

Pulling into the infield I had a huge smile on my face. We got to park in the pit garages to prep.



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A early 90's Corvette and I were the only domestics. Everyone else was either a Porsche or BMW (cause this event was sponsored by their club). Lots of M3's and GT3's.



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Tech inspection is much more involved than any 1/4mile track I’ve been to. Everything is checked over. Every loose item has to be removed, floor mats, tools, amps/subs... My only infraction was having a loose alarm horn which was easily fixed.



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During the day there were 4 20min classroom sessions with 4 20min track time sessions. The ~30 students were split into the novice, intermediate, and advanced groups. Novice and intermediate groups had instructors sitting shotgun with them for every run. The first two lap of the day the instructor drove you around while you sat as a passenger to show you what to do.



We ran on Pocono's North Road Course; a 1.5 mile using turn 3 as a straightaway, followed by an infield with 4 turns of varying angles.



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It was an awesome experience. But while driving you really don’t have a change to look around and realize you’re actually on 'turn 3'. At the end of the straight away you have to brake hard and turn right while getting back on the power, a short sweep, brake hard, turn right and get on the power. Let the car move out after the apex and drift to the right side if the track. Hard, hard brake and turn left, hit the apex and come on the power. Let the car more to the right and then bring it back to the left. Quick brake, power, and turn right letting the car more the left after the turn. Come to the right, say on the power and take a wide left. Coming to the start/finish line you brake, and turn right, get on the power, and now your back onto the straightaway :)



I knew this would be hard on the car; similarly to drag racing, but 1/4mile doesn't even compare. After each run my trans temp was pegged (although scanning my car the trans temp only read a max of 175*). The combo of DHP fan kick on and 180* tstat helped keep the car cool (never broke 190*).

The brakes on the other hand... let's just say I'm glad the rules say you need a relatively new set and a fluid change. But, the stock rotors just couldn't take the abuse. I never broke, but the last laps of every session the brakes were crazy mushy.



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The class sessions were helpful. They helped show my ideas on how to handle a car on a turn were totally wrong. A sweeping turn, hitting the apex, and getting out is wrong. Doing it this way, since you are turning, the car is always in a state of being unbalanced, right at the edge of traction with tires squeeling. The blue line is the wrong way, the red line is the quickest way. Braking then turning allows the car to be more balanced because you aren’t at the edge of traction anymore, this way you gain much more speed getting out of the turn and have more room to maneuver if needed.



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I'm not knocking any of the drivers of gloating about myself, but I was the 2nd fastest car (the 1st was an M3 which should have been in the intermediate group). You can only pass cars on the 2 straightaway, and only when the car in front points you by (front windows must be kept down). I lapped a few cars during the last runs. I was very good when there were no other cars around me, but when I got close to a car I kept following their line (which for the most part was always off), so that messed me up. My instructor (coworkers husband) was still an awesome teacher.



So all in all a great day. Learned a lot and had fun.

But now, I really need to put on those 12" rotors I got from the WBodyStore. The stockers are shot. I learned suspension and power (the instructors said I had a ‘**** load’ of it :)), don’t really matter. It’s all about the brakes.
 
Call me a newbie, but I'm curious on the Physics of cornering they were teaching. Every "realistic" racing game I've played (namely the Gran Turismo series) have the players taking corners on your blue line for the fastest route. The red line, to me, seems to be counter-productive. Slow the car down, take a hard turn, then accelerate just seems to be more wasteful. You lose momentum and need to work the engine harder to bring it back to speed.



Am I speaking like a fool or is there something I don't know?
 
Am I speaking like a fool or is there something I don't know?
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No way, I thought the same thing going into this.



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Braking. Point "B" in the picture is the braking zone. All braking should be finished in a straight line then your foot is back on a constant throttle before turning into the corner.



Turn in. Point "I" is your entry into the corner starting at the outside edge of the track. You should have a steady steering angle and a constant speed to the apex.



Apex. Point "A" is where you are closest to the inside edge of the corner. The proper apex is usually not in the exact middle of a turn, but a little "late." Hitting the apex right determines how fast you can exit the corner. From the apex you should begin unwinding the steering and adding power as you now have available adhesion for accelerating. If you think about the Car Dynamics and Adhesion information above you will see that accelerating out of the corner will be an understeer situation. You won't require much steering input to "push" the car towards the outside of the track.



Turn out. Point "O" is the exit from the corner on the far edge of the track. At this point the steering wheel should be straight and you should be on full power.
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Another thing, if your taking that blue line, your tires at the limit of adhesion. If something were to happen somewhere on the blue line, where can you go? Turning right would do nothing cause you'd you just start sliding (understeer). The point is to keep the car balanced; you cant get more balanced than going in a straight line. This also gives you manuvering opportunities.
 
So it comes down to Safety over Speed then? Considering the split between Beginner, Intermediate, and Advanced, would it be safe to assume then the Red Line would be more for the less experienced racers who might not be comfortable with professional racing techniques?
 
No, the safety is just an added bonus. Everybody, every level, rwd or fwd, takes the red line.



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For this type of corner, the racing line very much depends on what follows the turn. The line which advances the middle phase is illustrated on the right. Its driver turns in and passes the apex relatively late in order to have a nice clear exit line for acceleration as soon as he is at the apex.

Illustrated on the left is the maximum constant radius line. The driver turns in much earlier and hits the apex sooner but is unable to accelerate until way beyond the apex. This racing line is smoother into the corner and, since braking can be left later, it is a method which favours overtaking into corners
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No, safety is just an added bonus. Everyone, every level, rwd/fwd, takes the red line.

With the blue line you are braking and turning (asking the front wheels to do too much). One you pass the apex you can finally straighten out the car and get back into the power. With the red line, your braking is done before you turn. Once you do turn, you can straighten out the wheel (while still in ther turn!) and get back into the power immediately and hit the real apex.

This way is truley faster



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For this type of corner, the racing line very much depends on what follows the turn. The line which advances the middle phase is illustrated on the right. Its driver turns in and passes the apex relatively late in order to have a nice clear exit line for acceleration as soon as he is at the apex.



Illustrated on the left is the maximum constant radius line. The driver turns in much earlier and hits the apex sooner but is unable to accelerate until way beyond the apex. This racing line is smoother into the corner and, since braking can be left later, it is a method which favours overtaking into corners.
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Oh, I should also mention, that on the red line, you aren't riding the brakes, when you hit them, you hit them hard, get it over with quick, then get back on the power.

With the blue line you are riding the brakes, then getting back onto the power more than 1/2 into the turn.

So lets say on the blue line, you enter the tuirn at 100mph, when you hit the blue's apex your at 50, before accelerating for the next 1/2 of the turn.

With the red line, you enter the turn at 50 mph to turn, but once you finish your turn you have 1/4 of the turn left to accelerate. So at the end of the turn the red line will yeild you a higher exit speed.
 
Sounds like you had a great time. The facilities look first rate.



I instruct at track days so I understand why they are teaching you the red line. It's a "late apex" line which is safer because you end up with more track on the trackout part of the turn.



Tracking is great education on car control...and it's addictive! :laugh:
 
Always a great time at the track! Like you now know there is only 1 real track. :2thumbs:



What brake pads where you using? I don't see too many rotors like that, unless the pads where very hard.



I had over 30 days in my 01 Z06 before I sold it, the friend who I sold it to still lets me drive it on track. :woot2:
 
I was using stock 10.9" rotors with Hawk HPS pads (I put the HPS pads in the day before the event).



The day of hard braking literally destroyed the rotors. The fins were a normal silver color before the track and the surface was smooth!

BEFORE \/\/\/

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I have a new set of 11.9" rotors I'm putting on next weekend. I assume the new pads I put in are ok.
 
Hawk HPS are very rough (as you see) on the rotors. Also the dust from them is murder on your paint and wheels. Have you looked at carbotech pads? Not sure if they make them for your GP or not, but they will not fade (depending on which ones you get) and the dust is not that bad.
 
Brad B. said:
I instruct at track days so I understand why they are teaching you the red line. It's a "late apex" line...
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"Friends don't let friends early-apex" ;)



ZeusCGP- Congrats on a great experience! Sounds like they did a good job instructing and that track-segment looks just right for your first time out.



Oh, and you did a good job of explaining why the "proper" line is the right one :xyxthumbs



Frapp- 99% of the time the fastest drivers are simply the most consistent and the smoothest.



Only time you early-apex is if somebody is trying to force you off the road by hitting your rear quarter panel; a late-apex increases the window of vulnerability to such stuff but is otherwise *always* the right line.
 
That looked like great fun. The facilities look fantastic (much better than what is available close to me). I love seeing people go to the track occassionally. The car control skills that can be learned are great. I was amazed on my first experience just how much handling is a car. It also cures one of wanting to do stupid things on public roads.



As for late vs. early apex....isn't the fastest line the one between those two? A track junkie with more experience than me should chime in. I was always under the impression that "late apexing" was the safest for the beginner but not the fastest method through the corner. Of course I consider myself a beginner and I have always thought late is better than losing it so have never been ready to push it more until I have dedicated track car that if I bend it won't hurt me in more ways than just physically.
 
Brad B. said:
Sounds like you had a great time. The facilities look first rate.



I instruct at track days so I understand why they are teaching you the red line. It's a "late apex" line which is safer because you end up with more track on the trackout part of the turn.



Tracking is great education on car control...and it's addictive! :laugh:
Click to expand...



teach me teach me!
 
Actually I was reading in my RACER magazine that the open wheels teams are finding it faster to follow the red line. It's goofy and I don't notice any of the drivers doing it but that is what they said.



That is awesome you got to drive on a track like that.
 
I was always under the impression that "late apexing" was the safest for the beginner but not the fastest method through the corner.
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All the professional racers I've spoken with claimed the late apex is the proper line unless you have a *very* good reason for doing something else. It gets you through the corner the fastest- less turning before the corner, less time *in* the corner, wheels straight for max power sooner coming out of the corner.



Note that Bob Bondurant claimed that his (considerable) sucess as a professional racer came from always late apexing corners while his competition used different lines.



Even in Bondurant's Advanced Road Racing course, where we really pushed the envelope, the late apex was the fastest way to do it. They taught us the same thing at Skip Barber too.



IMO the main reason why people don't always *take* the right line is that it's much easier said than done.
 
Looks like you had a great time! I hear Pocono is a really fun track. I'll be doing the same thing this year at Mid-Ohio and BeaveRun in PA.
 
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