Compared compounds today...

R

RAG

New member
Just thought I'd share my findings:



While detailing a black Tahoe today I decided to compare compunds - I tested to see how much each cut and how well each finished down. I judged cut not only by the amount of swirls removed, but I also lightly sanded the panels with 3000 paper so I could see how well they removed sanding lines. I only tested the best compounds I know of...PG, OHC, HTEC, HTHC, and Pro's #27. I used a white LC VC pad via rotary at 1500 RPMs for the testing. I ranked the cut from 1 to 10 and the finish quality left from 1 to 10 (10 being no visible swirls).



HTEC - Cut 9, finish 7

HTHC - Cut 7.5, finish 8

PG (+20RMG) - cut 8, finish 7.5

OHC - cut 7, finish 7

Pro's #27 - cut 7, finish 7.5



For me, the most impressive compound for the amount of cut relative to the finish quality was HiTemp's Heavy Cut (mixed with about 10% OP) - under halogens I could barely barely see the buffer swirls.



Though HTEC gives more cut, for me it is too big of a leap on a black vehicle to go straight to a final finishing polish, as I always seem to find a couple buffer marks here and there when I pull it out into the sun...but not so with the HT Heavy Cut; unfortunately it has a tendancy to dry too fast and gum up, but adding in some #27 (actually a very good compound in its own right) seemed to be the best mix I could come up with.





Gotta run...
 
Perfect! This is the exact thing i've been looking for. Thanks Rag. Have you tried mixing the OP with the EC? I wonder how it would come out if you mixed OP with Heavy Cut too... 10% better at least!
 
Interesting about the HTHC, did you try to mix in some OP on the pad, or in the bottle?



I haven't picked up my heavy cut in quite some time becasue EC works so well for me--I will give it a try.



Thanks for sharing.
 
What would be a good compound for a PC7424? I need something more aggressive then #83 for my daughters car.
 
artikxscout said:
Perfect! This is the exact thing i've been looking for. Thanks Rag. Have you tried mixing the OP with the EC? I wonder how it would come out if you mixed OP with Heavy Cut too... 10% better at least!
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Yes, I got the idea of mixing in OP from epcivic (above post)...and though it greatly improves the product's workability, it comes at a price - I found that it drastically reduced the cut (I did this experiment on a black honda I detailed). By mixing in Pro's #27 Ultimate Cutter, there is no noticable loss in cut (#27 can be worked FOREVER like OP or OHC) but I actually like it better than OHC, just a bit more expensive.
 
Guy said:
What would be a good compound for a PC7424? I need something more aggressive then #83 for my daughters car.
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I think you should try HTEC, it has a ton more cut than #83, and will leave the surface with about the same amount of haze/marring.
 
ebpcivicsi said:
Interesting about the HTHC, did you try to mix in some OP on the pad, or in the bottle?



I haven't picked up my heavy cut in quite some time becasue EC works so well for me--I will give it a try.



Thanks for sharing.
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I'll still probably use EC more often, it just employs some slightly larger abrasives which leave the surface a little too swirled for me on black to go straight to a final finishing polish...but I'm sure it depends on how much pressure you use, etc. HTHC does not hace as much cut, but the finish quality left is noticably better. But for other colors, and for my 3-step polish jobs on black, HTEC will be getting the nod for sure. And HTEC is BY FAR the best compound I've ever used with wool.
 
I use Menzerna S34A(20%) and Menzerna PO85RD3.02(80%) works great with my favourite wool pad and rotary. No dust or splatter just clean cutting power.
 
RAG said:
I'll still probably use EC more often, it just employs some slightly larger abrasives which leave the surface a little too swirled for me on black to go straight to a final finishing polish...but I'm sure it depends on how much pressure you use, etc. HTHC does not hace as much cut, but the finish quality left is noticably better. But for other colors, and for my 3-step polish jobs on black, HTEC will be getting the nod for sure. And HTEC is BY FAR the best compound I've ever used with wool.
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Great, thanks for the info. What does the PRO #27 run a gallon in your neck of the woods?
 
Very informative. Thanks for the info RAG!



I have read that some use OC without following with a polishing step, and considering OHC isn't that abrasive, do you think you would be able to use it without having to follow up with a polish step?
 
tustah said:
Very informative. Thanks for the info RAG!



I have read that some use OC without following with a polishing step, and considering OHC isn't that abrasive, do you think you would be able to use it without having to follow up with a polish step?
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On white and silver you could probably get away with it...and most of the guys who "finish" with OC are using DA polishers...I mostly use the rotary. If you want a lot of cut for a finishing polish, I get more cut with PO106FF than OC, and yet it leaves a MUCH better final finish...better than anything else I've tried.



But no way could you use OHC without a subsequent step...if that's what your asking.
 
ebpcivicsi said:
Great, thanks for the info. What does the PRO #27 run a gallon in your neck of the woods?
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I think I pay about $20 for a quart...never seen it offered in a gallon. Kinda expensive I know, which is why I want to see HTEC and HTHC improved (stand alone, I swear it dries up in two passes)...but with #27 added, I don't loose hardly any aggressiveness or finish quality and can get a good 4 or 5 passes in without problem.
 
i always seem to get three or four passes with hc @1500 maybe its the tijuana atmosphere thats drying your product out lol
 
RAG said:
I think I pay about $20 for a quart...never seen it offered in a gallon. Kinda expensive I know, which is why I want to see HTEC and HTHC improved (stand alone, I swear it dries up in two passes)...but with #27 added, I don't loose hardly any aggressiveness or finish quality and can get a good 4 or 5 passes in without problem.
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Great, I have a local distributor, but they are scondrels!!!!! I will pay them a visit and see what I can talk them down to. I swear it's like that in there. :(
 
RAG- Thanks for doing the comparison and posting your findings.



Guy said:
What would be a good compound for a PC7424? I need something more aggressive then #83 for my daughters car.
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I mixed H-T EC with 1Z Ultra/Extra (just put them both on the pad) and it worked OK with the PC using 4" pads. I dunno if I'd try it with larger pads though. The 1Z is aggressive in its own right, and PC/hand-friendly, it has a *LONG* work time and lets you work the EC until it breaks down.
 
I was at Hi-Temp's shop on Friday (they're located here in Omaha), and I was talking with the guy behind the counter about how well Heavy Cut has been received at Autopia, and how much I like it (it's become my go-to lately). He mentioned that Light and Medium cut are solvent/oil based, whereas Heavy Cut is water based. Perhaps just a spritz of water would help extend the working time?



Next time I'm picking something up at Hi-Temp, I'll mention that a few people here have noted HTHC could use a little longer work time.



Tort
 
RAG said:
Though HTEC gives more cut, for me it is too big of a leap on a black vehicle to go straight to a final finishing polish, as I always seem to find a couple buffer marks here and there when I pull it out into the sun...but not so with the HT Heavy Cut; unfortunately it has a tendancy to dry too fast and gum up, but adding in some #27 (actually a very good compound in its own right) seemed to be the best mix I could come up with.





Gotta run...
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Interesting! I came to the same conclusion, as much as I like EC, HC is my "go to"; since on even average/hard paint you can go from it to LSP.



Here is a copy/paste from another thread regarding HC.



Accumulator said:
Picus- Yeah, nice work. The VW looks great in that color, glad to hear the owner is gonna get it all fixed up.



How do you decide between H-T EC and HC? I'm a little suprised you don't just reach for the EC each time..do you find the two products to be *that* different?
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Yes, very much so actually. Now that I have used them more they definitely have different characteristics. EC has more bite, that goes without saying - I find it's harder to work which is why you add OP (or another polish) to it. I also find that while it finishes down nicely there is a significant difference between the finish of it and HC. With EC you definitely can't jump straight to LSP, with HC you could. HC is also much easier to work in general. I actually prefer HC, and use it whenever possible, but obviously in some cases you need the cut of EC.



On both the E55 and 330i I *could* have skipped 106ff; heavy cut on a light cut pad finishes down better than any "heavy" compound I've used.



Another note is that via PC I find EC to be almost useless (just imo) because HC has as much cut via PC and finishes down way better, AND is easier to use. I was just remarking to someone else that via PC I pretty much don't use anything but HC anymore. My Menz PG, IP, OHC, OC, and OP are all languishing.



All of this is just my experience of course. To give you an idea I bought 32oz bottles of EC and HC to try them, the EC is about 3/4 full and the HC is maybe 1/8th full now.
 
Picus,



Are you using the Heavy Cut Compound or HC Leveler? I'm assuming it's the leveler, but I was taught not to assume anything long ago, heh.



Thanks!



Mike
 
Yes, Leveler; sorry I should have specified that! I also have the compound but was not as impressed. Similar cut but a lot more micromarring.
 
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