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Old 08-08-06, 02:07   #1 (permalink)
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How to use Zaino (with comments by Sal Zaino)

Okay, I just spent 15 minutes talking to Sal Zaino about my plan below and he had a lot of interesting things to say (great guy). Based on that conversation, here's my final plan:

NOTE: I have a metallic midnight blue (almost black) Porsche 911 cabriolet (so no top to finish).

1. I will wash my car as usual with with Griots Car Wash (although Sal likes his better ).

2. I'll clay as needed using Griots Clay as I like it more than Sonus & Zaino's. (I don't clay while washing because I have to wash in the sun and that will result in water spots)

3. I'll polish any defects out of the paint using Griots Machine Polish 3 (or 2 if there any bad spots).

4. I prepare the paint with a coat of Griots Paint Prep which helps to remove wax & sealants. Sal recommends washing again at this step, but he didn't seem very familiar with Paint Prep, so I don't believe re-washing is necessary.

------- From here on I discussed each step with Sal personally on the phone today and he approved these steps -----

5. I'll spray the car down with one coat of Z6 and wipe it off (in sections of course) using a blue Sonus MF towel.

6. I'll mix a HALF ounce of Z5 Pro with 2 drops of ZFX and apply a THIN layer to the whole car (as I would do with Klasse AIO & SG) using a Z6 moistend microfiber applicator (orange Sonus ones).

7. Based on Sal's comments, by the time I'm done applying to the whole car it should be ready to remove. I'll test it first, but it sounds a lot like the dry time of Klasse AIO (an on / off product).

8. I'll buff off the first coat in the garage and then repeat steps 5 & 6. I'll repeat step 7 afterwards. Sal says 2 coats of Z5 Pro is plenty. Anymore is just wasting the product.

9. I'll REPEAT step 5 (Z6), then I'll use straight Z2 Pro WITHOUT ZFX and apply a THIN layer to the whole car using a Z6 moistend microfiber applicator for one final coat. (NOTE: Sal says your final coat doesn't need ZFX. You can use it, but it isn't required NOR is a long cure time required - wipe on and wipe off is sufficent).

10. According to Sal, immediately after the last coat of Z2 Pro has been removed, I'll ]finish with a SINGLE coat of Z8 when I do a full car wipe down using a Sonus Blue MF towel.

Sal claims that steps 5 - 10 could be done in as little as 45 minutes with the best possible results that the product will offer. I don't think I move that fast, but I guess the real point is that all of these claims about long cure times don't offer any benefit (according to Sal).

If I have the engergy, I might prep my windows and wheels and do those in advance of the Sunday marathon.

Other interesting notes from my conversation with Sal:
  • Sal claims that Werkerstat and Klasse products are made by the same supplier so they are the same product. Both are VOC compliant which he claims translates into Klasse AIO not being as good now as it used to be before it was VOC compliant. He's not a fan of Klasse, but I love the stuff personally.
  • He stated clearly that you SHOULD NOT use Z8 moistened applicators, but rather use Z6. He made it sound like that it was a waste, but he was pretty clear that I shouldn't do that.
  • He seemed to think there is no harm in putting some Z8 in with your Z5 or Z2. He doesn't feel like he can notice any benefit, but he said it doesn't hurt and if someone can see a benefit then sure go for it.
  • He stated the main benefit of ZFX is to allow immediate curing. The reduced dry time is a side effect, but not the purpose of ZFX. He said that it is nonsense to think that using Z2 Pro or Z5 Pro with ZFX requires long cure times - it simply doesn't.
  • Sal said there's no advantage to NOT using ZFX - he claims it is required if you are going to do multiple coats in the same day, but it isn't required on the last coat (but you can still use it if you like).
  • If you screw up with any Zaino product (Z2, Z5, Z8, etc...) then you should simply get a wet towel and wipe it off. In the case of Z2 & Z5 with ZFX, you don't need to re-apply because the bottom layer would have bonded, so you are good to go for your next step.

If you have ANY questions about these claims, I encourage you to send mail to Sal (sal@zainobros.com) and then call him at 732-833-8800 to discuss it (he'll tell you to call him in e-mail).
 
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Old 08-08-06, 02:12   #2 (permalink)
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I used to speak to Sal often, and he was always willing to chat and offer his opinions. I don't know of too many companies (detail oriented or not) where you can go straight to the top and talk with the CEO about whatever you like, usually on Sal's dime too. Customer service has always been a Zaino strong suit.

LOL, Sal was never a fan of Klasse, but Carlack makes both product lines...
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Old 08-08-06, 02:14   #3 (permalink)
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Thanks for the post.


Your proposed process mimicks what I usually do for my personal vehicles (abbreviated for customers).
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Old 08-08-06, 02:19   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TigerMike
I used to speak to Sal often, and he was always willing to chat and offer his opinions. I don't know of too many companies (detail oriented or not) where you can go straight to the top and talk with the CEO about whatever you like, usually on Sal's dime too. Customer service has always been a Zaino strong suit.

LOL, Sal was never a fan of Klasse, but Carlack makes both product lines...
Yeah, he's a funny guy. I could see how he could really rub people the wrong way if you didn't go in knowing this guy has your stereotypically New Jersey attitude, but I was prepared for that so I got a lot of good laughs.

I could totally tell that if I was there he would have smacked me upside the head for my first plan of attack based on feedback I solicited. His first comment was "you are making this WAY too hard".

When I gave him crap about ZFX (which is a sore spot for him) he said do you go down in the morning and have your coffee pre-made with sugar and cream in it? What's the friggin problem then?

He also explained that ZFX is a product that he hates because he can't just put it in the product right away, but it serves a good purpose until he figures out how to require the separate mixing step.
 
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Old 08-08-06, 02:24   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronmart
Other interesting notes from my conversation with Sal:

Werkerstat and Klasse products are made by the same supplier...Both are VOC compliant which he claims translates into Klasse AIO not being as good now as it used to be before it was VOC compliant.
These facts have been widely known for quite some time.
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Old 08-08-06, 02:26   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronmart
Yeah, he's a funny guy. I could see how he could really rub people the wrong way if you didn't go in knowing this guy has your stereotypically New Jersey attitude, but I was prepared for that so I got a lot of good laughs.

I could totally tell that if I was there he would have smacked me upside the head for my first plan of attack based on feedback I solicited. His first comment was "you are making this WAY too hard".

When I gave him crap about ZFX (which is a sore spot for him) he said do you go down in the morning and have your coffee pre-made with sugar and cream in it? What's the friggin problem then?

He also explained that ZFX is a product that he hates because he can't just put it in the product right away, but it serves a good purpose until he figures out how to require the separate mixing step.
Yep, while he is generally a pretty nice guy (albeit with strong Jersey influences), Sal is straight to the point, and no BSing around. Just doesn't have time for it I imagine.

I used to have a picture of Sal behind the wheel of a Diablo I believe, but I can't find the pic now...
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Old 08-08-06, 02:29   #7 (permalink)
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Thanks for sharing the info!!! Can't wait to see pics of your car when you are done.

I also talked to Sal (yesterday) before placing an order. Its so nice to be able to talk to "the man" himself.
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Old 08-08-06, 02:37   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
9. I'll REPEAT step 5 (Z6), then I'll use straight Z2 Pro WITHOUT ZFX and apply a THIN layer to the whole car using a Z6 moistend microfiber applicator for one final coat. (NOTE: Sal says your final coat doesn't need ZFX. You can use it, but it isn't required NOR is a long cure time required - wipe on and wipe off is sufficent).
that part is good to know. thanks for the info!
 
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Old 08-08-06, 02:42   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZaneO
These facts have been widely known for quite some time.

True story. I've known this for almost a year.



Ron: He gave me the:


"Ask a painter to paint a car without a catalyst" in regards to ZFX .
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Old 08-08-06, 02:45   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZaneO
These facts have been widely known for quite some time.
Not to me, which is why I repeated it. I also know that there are some people on this forum (in one of the old threads I was on) who I've seen swearing up and down Wekerstatt (sp?) is WAY better than Klasse, so obviously they didn't know.
 
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Old 08-08-06, 02:47   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G35stilez
True story. I've known this for almost a year.



Ron: He gave me the:


"Ask a painter to paint a car without a catalyst" in regards to ZFX .
Ha, ha, ha - that must be his standard line then because he said the same exact thing to me.
 
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Old 08-08-06, 03:25   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blkZ28Conv
There is probably no need to perform a Dawn wash if you plan on using the Groit paint prep. Just do a Z7 wash prior to the Groit step.


On a Porsche or any vehicle of this size, I would only mix-up 1/2 oz of Z5PRO and 2 drops of ZFX. This should be plenty for 2 very thin applications. Spritzing the applicator pad with Z6 during application really aids in applying very thin layers and efficient usage of sealant.

When applying the top coat of Z2PRO change your pad moistening solution to Z8 and apply again a very thin coat. Allow a little more drying time (~30-45 mins). I would not Z8 until at least 6 hours later especially sense the Z2PRO coats was not ZFX enabled. It is important to let the previously applied layers to evolve (cure and settle) before adding more to the system.

In reality your planned next re-application is not necessary or will augment any appreciable gains in protection or durability. A single application of Z8 on Sunday will boost the general appearance and add that finishing "POP" is all that will be needed because of the high quality of the finish on a Porsche from my experience.

Wash. I would clay as I washed vehicle using washing solution as lube
Polish - if needed but highly recommended to produce the maximum natural gloss and depth of finish.
Cleanse with Griot
Z6 wipedown (this step greatly helps in the application of sealant (next few steps))

Mixed 1/2 oz Z5PRO with 2 drops of ZFX
Apply with Z6 moistened applicator - THIN COATS
Allow to dry
Buff
Z6 wipedown - optional
Re-apply Z5PRO/ZFX with Z6 moistened applicator
Allow to dry
Buff
Z6 wipedown - optional but highly recommended at this point.

Apply Z2PRO with a Z8 moistened applicator

Allow to fully dry (may take longer because of ZFX not used)
Buff.

Stand back and admire your beautiful vehicle.

Z8 next day

Finish!!!!!

Hope this helps.

I guess Sal and I somewhat disagree on this step.

Sal stated that you do not have to worry about curing after application but I am sure he emphasized that the product must be dry prior to buffing off (finger swipe test). The Pro series does dry rapidly but do not buff until it does such. 15-30 mins in most cases. We can not over-emphasize the importance of very thin coats to reach this short drying time.

Have fun this weekend Ron!!!
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